Blogroll Me! How This Old Brit Sees It ...: U.S. Torture Shame; Spain Also Steps Up To The Plate ...

15 November 2005

U.S. Torture Shame; Spain Also Steps Up To The Plate ...

Strictly speaking, the copy on the powerful picture placed above is only half true. Since, as the sane civilised half of the United States well knows -- as well as over half the rest of the world -- it seems the brain dead, belligerent bloodthirsty Bush supporting bunch couldn't care less.

Moreover, there's a considerably sized sub-set and/or sub-species of red necked, extreme right wingers who would welcome even more blood & gore. So long as it's some other poor sod's of course, and not their own.

Shame? Such Neanderthals have yet to hear of such a word.

Carefully crafted yet demonstrably, dubious denials from Donald Rumsfeld et all, cut precisely no ice at all in the real free world outside the United States' very own, albeit candy-coated, Bush era's iron curtain.

Bush's America [often aided & abetted by Blair's Britain] is serially sending out 'subjects' to countries where torture isn't outlawed -- indeed, such appalling mediaeval 'sport' is almost the norm in some of the places some sad souls are still shipped.

But even though the deny, deny, deny crap keeps on coming, the wider and wiser world knows better.

The latest in an increasingly longer line of civilized countries catching on to what's going on, is Spain.

Spain probes 'secret CIA flights'

Secrecy surrounds US "war on terror" prisoner transfersSpain is launching an investigation into claims that CIA planes carrying terror suspects made secret stopovers on Spanish soil.

Interior Minister Jose Antonio Alonso made the announcement on Spanish television on Tuesday.

He said that if proven, such activities could damage relations between the Spanish and US governments.


The first flight allegedly landed in Palma, on the island of Majorca, on 22 January 2004. The suspect flights - by two Boeing 747s and two Gulfstream jets - allegedly continued until 17 January 2005.

And now even the EU itself, is advising it's member states how best to go about uncovering more evidence of these unforgivable, state sanctioned undercover operations.
EU urged to probe 'CIA prisons'

Human rights groups have criticized US treatment of prisoners

Members of the European Parliament have urged the EU's executive Commission to investigate allegations that the CIA used secret prisons in eastern Europe.

But EU Justice Commissioner Franco Frattini told the MEPs late on Monday that it was up to individual governments to investigate the claims.

Recent reports in the US press alleged that US secret agents had interrogated terror suspects in eastern Europe.

Poland and Romania - named in the allegations - have denied the reports.

Yeah, sure. So poor innocent little Romania and Poland are just being picked on, eh? Yeah, you better believe they are -- and with very good reason.

So simply stick to the script, eh? Deny, deny, deny.

Well, This Old Brit wants you to know this, you shameless shower of sycophantic, sicko shits; your sold-out souls are already way beyond saving.

And today, courtesy of Common Dreams we can read this -- straight from the horses mouth, as they say. Though the Tony in question still stops short of actually admitting to torture -- erroneously, electing to employ excruciating euphemisms such as 'Harsh Techniques'.

Former U.S. Army Interrogator Describes the Harsh Techniques He Used in Iraq,

Detainee Abuse by Marines and Navy Seals and Why "Torture is the Worst Possible Thing We Could Do"

*With deep remorse, former U.S. Army interrogator Specialist Tony Lagouranis talks about his own involvement with abusing detainees in Iraq and torture carried out by the Navy Seals.

He apologizes to the Iraqi people and urges U.S. soldiers to follow their conscience. Lagouranis returned from Iraq in January and until now had given no live interviews.

But Lagouranis says he now feels it his duty to speak out about what he witnessed in Iraq:- His use of harsh interrogation techniques on prisoners in Iraq including dogs, sleep deprivation, prolonged isolation and dietary manipulation.- How Navy SEALS induced hypothermia by using ice water to lower the body temperature of prisoners.

As always, along with This Old Brit, Richard reports.

But you decide.


Anonymous graniab said...

Can you just imagine the vast sums of money that the US shovels into these countries that 'kindly' house our torture chambers?

11:09 pm  
Blogger D.F. Facti said...

Disgusting. Not one useful shred of information will come out of this. We have sacrificed everything for nothing.

12:06 am  
Blogger Elaine Supkis said...

And Congress is STILL bickering over what or who can be tortured.

I wish they were all put in former Soviet camps and 're-educated'.

12:14 am  
Anonymous graniab said...

That works for me Elaine!

12:19 am  
Anonymous bluey said...

so, half the world's got you in it's sights for torture/abuse and worse and calling you the bad guys ........ then surprise, surprise, you suddenly find some iraqis that SOMEONE ELSE else has been torturing/abusing

wow, what fortunate timing ..... so suddenly you can say see -we're really good guys

you got to hand it to these shitheads - they're smart alright

this from the bbc

US 'troubled' by Iraq abuse claim

Iraqi security forces have faced repeated allegations of abuse
Washington has said it is troubled by the alleged abuse of more than 170 detainees held by Iraqi security forces in Baghdad and backs an investigation.
Iraqi Prime Minister Ibrahim Jaafari has ordered an investigation into the alleged abuse of the detainees.

The prisoners, many malnourished and some showing signs of apparent torture, were found by US troops on Sunday.

The allegations come as the US faces pressure to be more transparent about the treatment of its prisoners.

The Bush administration has been swift to distance itself from these latest reports of prisoner abuse, reports the BBC's Jonathan Beale in Washington.

The US is backing the Iraqi government inquiry and believes those responsible for mistreatment should be held to account.

Fresh allegations have also surfaced of US troops mistreating detainees.

Prime Minister Ibrahim Jaafari said the prisoners had now been moved
Two former Iraqi prisoners have told US TV they were beaten, fired at with rubber bullets and subjected to mock executions at the hands of US troops in 2003.

While the US insists that it does not condone torture, it has lobbied against legislation that would ban all inhumane treatment of detainees.

Read more here

11:18 am  
Anonymous xpatyank said...

The UK Independent has more details on this today -- dates, places, people and more. Here's a cut and paste.

** One flight arrived from Algiers on 22 January 2004 and took off the next day for Macedonia. There it allegedly collected a Lebanese-born German man, Khaled Masri, and took him to Kabul where he was beaten and interrogated over alleged links with al-Qa'ida.
Other flights reportedly went to and from Libya and from Bucharest to Washington.
Destinations included Ireland, Morocco and Sweden; countries of origin included Algeria, Romania and Egypt, El Pais said.
The planes were said to be US-registered and used by Stevens Express Leasing, listed by The New York Times among those used by the CIA to transport suspects.

Mr Alonso urged caution: "The matter is in the hands of a judge and we will see what his conclusions are." The row has killed any nascent Spanish-American rapprochement. "I cannot comment on such a sensitive matter," a US embassy spokesman in Madrid said. **

2:14 pm  
Blogger Gert said...

Great post, Richard! You weren't mincing your words there, were you?

3:25 pm  
Blogger Richard said...

Well, I can't argue with anything anyone's said - heh - especially, gert. ;^)

Seriously, thanks again everyone for your support and invaluable input. It's much appreciated, as always.

10:20 pm  
Anonymous dubhaltach said...

Just to remind you all that a few days from now is the 60th anniversary of the start of the first Nuremberg trial:

November 20, 1945 to October 1, 1946.

(The International Military Tribunal was opened on October 18, 1945.)

I don't think I need to comment on the irony.

5:45 pm  
Anonymous kiwi said...


But no doubt the Bushmob will come up with something like ;

Aaarhh, but we never signed up to that.

6:18 pm  
Anonymous graniab said...

Richard - I posted a comment on LA in response to your comment. But I neglected to make a new paragraph after the first sentence. So the 'anti-American bullshit' does not refer to you but the many conservative loonies that frequent that site. Sorry about that - Grania

9:06 pm  
Blogger Richard said...


Thanks re;reminder and, I think "irony" is an understatement. Eh?


Well, even if not those exact words, I'll bet you're not far wrong.


No problem; I knew it was aimed at the loonies at LA.
I read pretty regularly there but post only occaisionaly. Heh, my patience isn't what it was -- and it wasn't ever that much in the first place.
Now & again I respond to a loony but usually, quite simply I can't be bothered; they just don't want to know.

9:45 pm  
Anonymous dubhaltach said...

For Gert and anyone else who enjoys that sort of thing:

google bombs we have known and loved:



Can you say "miserable failure?"

Yes I thought you could :-)

11:49 am  
Anonymous dubhaltach the tempter said...

And for the techie minded amongst us or even just those who have a ... how do i put it? .... certain amount of schadenfreude in our make up dubhaltach media research services proudly present:

Little yellow elephant

Make sure you read the comments. (I especially liked this one:)

" Don't be too hard on Mr. Hoffman!

What we have here is a young man whose life long personality is still in formation.

As with most young Republicans, there is a titanic battle between stupidity, cowardice, deceit, and hubris for the mastery of his essence.

I hope that the judge lets him join the Marines instead of the usual prison term that internet threats agains Dear Leader usually earn.

Let him prove his patriotism in mortal combat with the Islamifascists!"

Go on click it you know you want to it's work safe but don't have any coffee in your mouth when you read it :-)

12:36 pm  
Blogger Richard said...


I just paid a visit to that place and placed a pithy comment re the pathetic prick in question. I simply couldn't resist. ;^)

2:35 pm  
Anonymous dubhluciferach said...

he he he - what could be a better way of spending a cold Friday afternoon while I am waiting for my girlfriend to arrive than putting temptation into the path of my new friend Richard? Did I mention that my middle name was "Lucifer" :-)))))


You won't believe what the troll called lycfyg-LQ has said on this thread about Rep. Murtha's call for the US to withdraw from Iraq.

Let me quote it for you in full:

lycfyg-LQ Says:
November 18th, 2005 at 6:40 am

"Some liberal bulldog. She dishes out her lies and won’t take comments?
How about if Hank debates her any time or place she wishes?
Let’s see if she has any real bulldog in her.
I would just turn her over my knee, spank her and send her back to the kitchen where she belongs. She is a classic example of why women should not vote. They are socialist by nature. Men have no excuse for that disease - unless they are not real men."

I um left one or two very definitely non-worksafe links for him as he seems to be afraid of women.

What is it with these people? I have women friends and women competitors often they are both. I like knowing that if I win then it is because I am the best at whatever it is at that time. Not that I am the best at whatever it is at that time who happens to have a penis. And why are they so afraid of gays? I know lots of gays and I haven't been raped yet. on the one hand gays are evil predators who are going to force a fate worse than death on all of us and on the other they're a bunch of weaklings who cannot even open a box of matches without fainting from the effort. A little inconsistent no?

4:21 pm  
Blogger Richard said...

I'll check it out later, dubhaltach.

Meanwhile, I see from Technorati that the number of sites linking to This Old Brit has recently dropped from 30 to 27.

Maybe there are more unliberals amongst the so called liberal sites than we thought. Pseudo-libs or Neo-libs, ya think?Hmm. Must have been something we said, eh? Maybe the truth hurts - some we never expected it to.

Ha! We should worry - not.

5:12 pm  
Anonymous graniab said...

Dubhaltach - I just checked out LA you are BAAAAAD! Keep it up!

8:03 pm  

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